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best 4k picture discs

bmoney

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #15 on: November 29, 2016, 09:49:12 AM »
most of the time the BR will be inferior to teh 4k disc (actually I have yet to find the opposite true)

but a BR will 100% look better on a 4k PJ than a standard PJ (in my case the rs400 vs the ae8000)

ellisr63

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2016, 09:52:30 AM »
What I am curious about is how a BR looks up-scaled vs a 4K disc.
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bmoney

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #17 on: November 29, 2016, 10:21:31 AM »
What I am curious about is how a BR looks up-scaled vs a 4K disc.

I know...and its what Im telling you...its closer....but not nearly the same.so basically:

BR>upscaled BR>4k


AVSCraig

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2016, 06:27:56 PM »
See for yourself this Sat. !!  But upscaling doesn't provide a WCG or more headroom on the disc, or less picture noise, or more actual picture information, so I generally don't bother. Pouring 2 Buck Chuck in a Chateau Petrus bottle doesn't make it taste any better either, unfortunately.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2016, 06:30:52 PM by AVSCraig »
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ellisr63

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #19 on: November 29, 2016, 06:51:45 PM »
See for yourself this Sat. !!  But upscaling doesn't provide a WCG or more headroom on the disc, or less picture noise, or more actual picture information, so I generally don't bother. Pouring 2 Buck Chuck in a Chateau Petrus bottle doesn't make it taste any better either, unfortunately.

Sometimes the intoxication does make everything seem to meld better though. ;)
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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #20 on: November 30, 2016, 02:47:30 AM »
most of the time the BR will be inferior to teh 4k disc (actually I have yet to find the opposite true)

but a BR will 100% look better on a 4k PJ than a standard PJ (in my case the rs400 vs the ae8000)

That dont have much to do with the content on the disc, its related to display limitations/ tech. Thats the nature of fixed pixel displays, and you will find that changing as your screen gets smaler.. Thats why we are some still using good CRT projectors, to be free of the hard edge square artificial pixel structure, if Digital ever evolves to a laser drawing the image on screen, using the laser as the light source and scan device, im also sure you will find that your less depending on resolution, try defocus your 1080P projector slightly to hide the pixel grid, if it dont trow off convergence, and make optical flaring its a good way to make it look more natural, and skip the scaling and wobulation.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2016, 10:15:22 AM by stridsvognen »
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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #21 on: November 30, 2016, 02:17:51 PM »
I kept my Oppo BDP 103 Blu Ray player, which has been handy to play the Blu Ray on and compare the 4K UHD BR that's in my Samsung 4K player. What I've found is that a " sharper picture " is not the main improvement ( some of these recent Blu Rays are plenty sharp ). A cleaner picture with much less picture noise, improved picture detail over the Blu ray, and a much more refined color palette is what I notice. Things just look more realistic ( not using HDR ). True, it's not perfect without having full blown 4K calibrating software, but it is a step up. I don't mind re - buying some movies, but mostly I will be buying new movies on 4K UHD BR going forward. Any improvement in the source material is welcome. You can buy better and better projectors until you turn blue in the face, but the source material will always be the limiting factor. That's why I got rid of all my DVD's ( except Team America, World Police, since the Blu Ray isn't the " unrated version " ).

A interesting test would be to calibrate Blu ray, and UHD to have the same gamma performance, i think a lot of the wow comes from the much higher gamma mastered on UHD discs, wich im sure you noticed when comparing BD vs UHD discs, even when displaying the UHD as SDR Rec 709. That means that colors look more saturated on UHD, more colorfull, so if your to compensate for the different gamma in the mastering you will have to calibrate a much lower gamma for your UHD settings, or a much higher gamma for the BD.

I think its hard to point the differences you experience directly to WCG or HDR, with very differently masters..

There is no doubt that higher resolution and a bigger color gammut is a good thing, i just dont see any signs of people having controle over it, i dont see anything but subjective opinions, who tell that its wow, so im thinking.. Hmmm wonder what they would think about DB if they calibrate a 2,8 gamma curve, and crank up the light output, that sure makes it more colorfull and dynamic.
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AVSCraig

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #22 on: November 30, 2016, 03:24:29 PM »
A interesting test would be to calibrate Blu ray, and UHD to have the same gamma performance, i think a lot of the wow comes from the much higher gamma mastered on UHD discs, wich im sure you noticed when comparing BD vs UHD discs, even when displaying the UHD as SDR Rec 709. That means that colors look more saturated on UHD, more colorfull, so if your to compensate for the different gamma in the mastering you will have to calibrate a much lower gamma for your UHD settings, or a much higher gamma for the BD.

I think its hard to point the differences you experience directly to WCG or HDR, with very differently masters..

There is no doubt that higher resolution and a bigger color gammut is a good thing, i just dont see any signs of people having controle over it, i dont see anything but subjective opinions, who tell that its wow, so im thinking.. Hmmm wonder what they would think about DB if they calibrate a 2,8 gamma curve, and crank up the light output, that sure makes it more colorfull and dynamic.

We just need calibration software to catch up. But in the mean time, I feel like I might as well start acquiring 4K discs. Hopefully 2017 sees 4K UHD calibration solutions become wide spread. And yes, there isn't the same kind of standards and "control " we have with 1080p. It's like the early days of HD DVD and Blu Ray. But no one is going to die if things aren't perfect. It's just somewhat annoying. Anyway, only around 3.5 % or 4% of my source material is 4K at this point !
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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #23 on: November 30, 2016, 03:53:35 PM »
We just need calibration software to catch up. But in the mean time, I feel like I might as well start acquiring 4K discs. Hopefully 2017 sees 4K UHD calibration solutions become wide spread. And yes, there isn't the same kind of standards and "control " we have with 1080p. It's like the early days of HD DVD and Blu Ray. But no one is going to die if things aren't perfect. It's just somewhat annoying. Anyway, only around 3.5 % or 4% of my source material is 4K at this point !

I only have 3 UHD movies, and not sure ill want to buy more at this time.. Im hoping there will be another HDR standard that makes sense for big screens, and then im waiting to see how the OPPO 203 will handle, as the Panasonic UB900 is not realy what i had expected, at least i would not expect croma issues on BD playback.
My hope was to benefit from the higher bit resolution and even running CRT ill never be using the UHD resolution, it should make for a 1080P 4:4:4 resolution.
Im not really good at beeing patient about this stuff, but ill try see if i can sit on my hands and let the first generation of players and movies pass by before i trow more money into it, just as i would like to try out the Lumagen Radiance Pro, but think it will be a very expensive experience with a to short lifespan..
The main limitation as i see it is all the tone mapping that has to be done, as there is no procesing/ remapping without a tradeoff.. So i think they should adapt the format more to the displays we have than trying to do something no display can do. How cool would it be if they made a 1080P 4:4:4 12 bit Rec 709 movie on a UHD disc, to use the full potential of the best 1080P displays, so we finaly see some sense to the deap color thing they implemented when that was the thing to have without a source for it. No scaling, no croma upsampling, just as pure untouched data as possible.
They could even master it for a higher peak light output, like 100 nit, and a higher gamma like 2,6 or so for a medium dynamic range, guess it would be something like the cinema standard.
The old BLACK IS Back..!!

bmoney

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #24 on: November 30, 2016, 07:13:18 PM »
Pacific rim is OUTSTANDING for PQ

Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #25 on: December 01, 2016, 04:51:21 AM »
Found this site for checking the resolution of the movies.. If its a real UHD resolution or just upscaled.
http://realorfake4k.com/my-product/pacific-rim/
The old BLACK IS Back..!!

Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #26 on: December 01, 2016, 05:08:29 AM »
Look whats on its way.. In real 4K..

http://realorfake4k.com/my-product/lawrence-of-arabia/

And it looks like its not mastrered in HDR, wich will be a nice one for the HT
« Last Edit: December 01, 2016, 05:10:14 AM by stridsvognen »
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bmoney

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2016, 06:59:12 AM »
watched Xmen:apolcolypse again

one of the best looking discs hands down...man its good

AVSMike

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2016, 07:12:22 AM »
watched Xmen:apolcolypse again

one of the best looking discs hands down...man its good

I have that disc. It and a few others are sitting unopened, waiting on the Oppo. I have seen the movie, but not in 4K with Atmos. Looking forward to it and several others.
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bmoney

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Re: best 4k picture discs
« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2016, 07:23:47 AM »
I have that disc. It and a few others are sitting unopened, waiting on the Oppo. I have seen the movie, but not in 4K with Atmos. Looking forward to it and several others.

ooh the atmos is also close to second to none!  you have great patience waiting :)

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