AVS Discussions
  Go Down

2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #90 on: August 13, 2019, 01:34:09 PM »
The contrast slider on a digital projector should not be used in this way, you are killing the projector when doing it, if you dont belive it please tell me what it does??8)
It lowers lightoutput and compresses the bit dept a bit, but can be done gently and preserve all information so that you can match lightoutput to a reference level for comparison on these plastic toy projectors.

Added by Mike Garrett
Either clean it up or I will continue to do so.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2019, 03:04:01 PM by AVSMike »

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #91 on: August 13, 2019, 01:34:29 PM »
What probe are you using here it only says simulated meter and you claim 500000:1 o/off why does it only say 300000:1 here??
Regards
Andreas                                                           

Calibration software: Lightspace and Calman. TPG: Murideo Fresco SIX-G
Meters: Klein K-10 A and Jeti 1501. THX II certified.

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #92 on: August 13, 2019, 01:38:25 PM »
It lowers lightoutput and compresses the bit dept a bit, but can be done gently and preserve all information so that you can match lightoutput to a reference level for comparison.
This is not the way to use the contrast slider on a digital projector, period! 8)
Regards
Andreas                                                           

Calibration software: Lightspace and Calman. TPG: Murideo Fresco SIX-G
Meters: Klein K-10 A and Jeti 1501. THX II certified.

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #93 on: August 13, 2019, 01:40:36 PM »
What probe are you using here it only says simulated meter and you claim 500000:1 o/off why does it only say 300000:1 here??
Klein K10A profiled to a JETI1501, wich i think was semi defective, we measured multiple scenarios with different brightness settings, that one ilustrated was 300000:1 others as high as 600000:1 and infinite if desired, we just worked on preserving the perfect out of black displaying every level.
We also made a 150000:1 setting wich we tested on various reference low level scenes and agreed that it looked gray like a digital.

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #94 on: August 13, 2019, 01:41:31 PM »
This is not the way to use the contrast slider on a digital projector, period! 8)
So please tell me what it do if you know.?

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #95 on: August 13, 2019, 01:48:38 PM »
So please tell me what it do if you know.?
If you really want to match the Sony 270 with the JVC in image brightness, buy an ND filter and then use the manual iris if you need to lower the brightness even further. I don't think you fully understand what the Contrast setting does on a digital projector.
A/V Reviewer
Home Theater Review
My Equipment

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #96 on: August 13, 2019, 01:50:34 PM »
So please tell me what it do if you know.?
It adjusts the clipping point, nothing else. And on most digitals today you dont have to adjust it at all.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2019, 01:55:24 PM by Andreas21 »
Regards
Andreas                                                           

Calibration software: Lightspace and Calman. TPG: Murideo Fresco SIX-G
Meters: Klein K-10 A and Jeti 1501. THX II certified.

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #97 on: August 13, 2019, 01:54:58 PM »
Klein K10A profiled to a JETI1501, wich i think was semi defective, we measured multiple scenarios with different brightness settings, that one ilustrated was 300000:1 others as high as 600000:1 and infinite if desired, we just worked on preserving the perfect out of black displaying every level.
We also made a 150000:1 setting wich we tested on various reference low level scenes and agreed that it looked gray like a digital.
Why does it say simulated meter when it should say Klein K10A?? You know the Yeti was mine when the profile was made, Didrik has bought it from me now so I am sure it is not accurate.8)

You think the Klein was defective when you get different reading from black when black measures 0.000, this also shows you have a lot to learn when it comes to calibration and equipment.:)
Regards
Andreas                                                           

Calibration software: Lightspace and Calman. TPG: Murideo Fresco SIX-G
Meters: Klein K-10 A and Jeti 1501. THX II certified.

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #98 on: August 13, 2019, 02:00:59 PM »
Stridsvognen you also says your CRT has the best analogue video chain, yet you use a Lumagen to calibrate it?? This makes me wonder?? I stopped using the old Lumagens due to all its flaws a long long time ago.
Regards
Andreas                                                           

Calibration software: Lightspace and Calman. TPG: Murideo Fresco SIX-G
Meters: Klein K-10 A and Jeti 1501. THX II certified.

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #99 on: August 13, 2019, 02:40:28 PM »
Yes, but from a digital standpoint, and how a digital image will be displayed through the projector, you can't lower the contrast setting to clip below level 235 and expect to get accurate contrast measurements. You need to think about these things in a digital way. When taking an on/off or ANSI contrast measurement, the digital level of white in test patterns is 235 so if you're clipping below that, you can't get an accurate measurement because you've artificially lowered how bright level 235 is because you've lowered the contrast setting too much. Does that make sense?

It seems you confuse lowering contrast with higher contrast, what i do is a bit the same as the super white function do, or like using a spyder probe for autocalibrating and afterwords having to lower red and loos 2fl compared to a manual calibration, sure im aware that by lowering contrast i lower the digital bit headroom, and has to be carefull with the 90-100% gamma dong start to elevate.
Yes its a compromise, and yes it lowers on off contrast due to the lower lightoutput, but if your eyes hurt running to bright do you prefer not using the projector, or set a comfortable lightoutput beeing carefull you maintain flat gamma and grayscale tracking.?What i see on the X5900 its getting a bit problematic below -7 contrast, so thats where i left it, and can set it back to 0 and it will still track, maybe you could measure and ilustrate what happens on your unit whan adjusting contrast, and what informatin your clipping, and explain how you balance the colors without touching gren and blue gain wich is basically a contrast pr color adjustment.?

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #100 on: August 13, 2019, 02:44:23 PM »
Why does it say simulated meter when it should say Klein K10A?? You know the Yeti was mine when the profile was made, Didrik has bought it from me now so I am sure it is not accurate.8)

You think the Klein was defective when you get different reading from black when black measures 0.000, this also shows you have a lot to learn when it comes to calibration and equipment.:)
Not sure how calman works he puled it up again after he came home and send the screenshot, if the measurement was 0.0000 the calculation could not really come out at 300000:1 would it.?The Klein worked perfectly, are you saying that he dont know how to use the software and meters.? 
« Last Edit: August 13, 2019, 03:17:45 PM by AVSMike »

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #101 on: August 13, 2019, 02:47:25 PM »
Stridsvognen you also says your CRT has the best analogue video chain, yet you use a Lumagen to calibrate it?? This makes me wonder?? I stopped using the old Lumagens due to all its flaws a long long time ago.
Please share whats the Lumagen flaws in details and what it do.? And how native CRT response works.?

It for sure have less than 5% digital correction in comparison to all digital projectors, maybe you care to explain why digitals need so massive correction and remapping.?

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #102 on: August 13, 2019, 02:54:25 PM »
It seems you confuse lowering contrast with higher contrast, what i do is a bit the same as the super white function do, or like using a spyder probe for autocalibrating and afterwords having to lower red and loos 2fl compared to a manual calibration, sure im aware that by lowering contrast i lower the digital bit headroom, and has to be carefull with the 90-100% gamma dong start to elevate.
Yes its a compromise, and yes it lowers on off contrast due to the lower lightoutput, but if your eyes hurt running to bright do you prefer not using the projector, or set a comfortable lightoutput beeing carefull you maintain flat gamma and grayscale tracking.?What i see on the X5900 its getting a bit problematic below -7 contrast, so thats where i left it, and can set it back to 0 and it will still track, maybe you could measure and ilustrate what happens on your unit whan adjusting contrast, and what informatin your clipping, and explain how you balance the colors without touching gren and blue gain wich is basically a contrast pr color adjustment.?
You have the JVC in low lamp mode, the iris a -15 and you still have issues with the image hurting your eyes?

The problem is that the contrast measurements you provide aren't valid because you're not setting the projector up like everyone else. You have to measure peak brightness with 235 resolved. Otherwise the measurements you provide are useless to compare to ours. 
A/V Reviewer
Home Theater Review
My Equipment

Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #103 on: August 13, 2019, 03:14:01 PM »
You have the JVC in low lamp mode, the iris a -15 and you still have issues with the image hurting your eyes?

The problem is that the contrast measurements you provide aren't valid because you're not setting the projector up like everyone else. You have to measure peak brightness with 235 resolved. Otherwise the measurements you provide are useless to compare to ours.
what contrast measurement link please.
I have 235 resolved, to clip 235 you need to adjust contrast in the positive direction to clip, your flipping it.

The cell phone clips it a bit but im sure you get the idea what contrast do when adjusted in different directions from the pictures.

« Last Edit: August 13, 2019, 03:40:06 PM by stridsvognen »

AVSMike

  • *****
  • 2010
Re: 2019 Sony 4K Projector Owners Thread
« Reply #104 on: August 13, 2019, 03:17:01 PM »
You have the JVC in low lamp mode, the iris a -15 and you still have issues with the image hurting your eyes?

The problem is that the contrast measurements you provide aren't valid because you're not setting the projector up like everyone else. You have to measure peak brightness with 235 resolved. Otherwise the measurements you provide are useless to compare to ours.
I was wondering how small the screen was and/or how high the gain is?
My Baffle Wall System: https://discuss.avscience.com/index.php?topic=124.msg902#msg902

Mike Garrett
AV Science Sales
585-671-2968
mike@avscience.com

JVC, Sony, Epson, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Stewart, Seymour, Screen Innovations, Screen Excellence, DNP, Da-Lite, Triad, SVS, Martin Logan & more.

  Go Up
 

SimplePortal 2.3.7 © 2008-2026, SimplePortal