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JVC Autocal Software V11 for RS1000/RS2000/RS3000/NX5/NX7/NX9 & calibration tips

bmoney

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thats alot of reserved!

Manni

thats alot of reserved!

You'll soon understand why :)

Javs

Just enter 00000000 as the serial to download the software :)
JVC X9500 (RS620) | OZTS Majestic 120" 16:9 | Marantz AV7702 MkII | Emotiva XPA-7 | Rotel RMB-1555B | iNuke 3000DSP | DIY Javelin Audio TPL-150 L/C/R | DIY Faital MTM TPL-150 Surrounds | DIY Dolby Atmos MKII Modules | 30cf/Net Quad 18" Subs

I just used an older models serial number and that worked too.

Manni

Yes, or any of the serial numbers shown during any of the shows... :) Most of them work, that's why I said "a serial number"  ;).

I've added a list of suggestions/improvements to send to JVC here: https://discuss.avscience.com/index.php?topic=1850.msg10384#msg10384

I'll update when we can actually work with V11 on the new models, but I thought it would be good to have a starting point. I will try to add a bit more content in the thread over the next few weeks, but the fun will really start when the units land.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2018, 07:49:31 AM by Manni »

Manni

I've edited the first post and started to populate the headings to most of the reserved posts, so that people get an idea of why I reserved so many. :)

I've also listed in post #2 an index of the topics I plan to cover and I've added the links to the couple of posts with actual content. I'll add the links as the content goes in.

There won't be much more posted until we get the units and we can start playing with them, but that should give an idea of the plan. Please let me know if you think I've forgotten a key aspect that you think should be covered.

There might be a few MadVR related sections at the end (only re HDR and calibration settings), but I don't want to have  the thread cluttered with MadVR related posts because not everyone is interested in that, so I'm not listing these topics yet. It might be better to create a separate thread for that. We'll see.

I'll post whenever I add new content, but I don't expect much to happen from my side until December now.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2018, 01:52:40 AM by Manni »

Manni

Having just said that, I thought that some might want to get a meter before the PJ shows up so they can hit the ground running, even if an Autocal isn't usually necessary with a new PJ. Anyway, here you go:

Which meter to use with V11?: https://discuss.avscience.com/index.php?topic=1850.msg10387#msg10387

Of course this preliminary advice is based on what we know about each meter (I own a Spyder 5 Pro that I use with V7 and an i1pro2 that I've used for years as a reference meter with various calibration software) and their use in previous Autocal versions. If you want certitude, wait a few weeks until we can test them with the new V11 and the RS2000.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2018, 03:29:02 PM by Manni »

Manni

Also added a preliminary Troubleshooting section, as I don't expect it to be very different with V11.

https://discuss.avscience.com/index.php?topic=1850.msg10392#msg10392

Javs

I sure hope this Autocal works well and reliably...

The Autocal v9 for the X9500 is severely dodgy, its VERY difficult to actually get it to calibrate colour properly at all without wildly undershooting the gamut, I dont even use it for that anymore, I actually found it better to load in a custom gamut taking into account the Spyder errors using the Excel method and then once I upload it, dont dare calibrate it with Autocal, but use the CMS to slightly tweak the tracking from there. Its OK for Gamma, though there was a bug with v1.0 where it would corrupt gamma measurements and have severe red push due to 'trash' frames flashing before gamma readings were done and actually corrupting the readings. They fixed that though luckily!

Autocal v10 was a lot better, I was able to calibrate the profiles properly first time and get accurate tracking on the X9900. The X7000 was a dream too, probably by far the easiest actually. The X9500 is just a pig to use Autocal on. Then again, could be just my unit...
JVC X9500 (RS620) | OZTS Majestic 120" 16:9 | Marantz AV7702 MkII | Emotiva XPA-7 | Rotel RMB-1555B | iNuke 3000DSP | DIY Javelin Audio TPL-150 L/C/R | DIY Faital MTM TPL-150 Surrounds | DIY Dolby Atmos MKII Modules | 30cf/Net Quad 18" Subs

Re: Basic: Which Meter to use?
« Reply #39 on: November 12, 2018, 04:05:45 AM »
    [PRELIMINARY]
    >snip<
    The x-Rite i1Pro 2 (you only need the basic version for projector/display calibration use)
    The i1pro 2 is a very good, semi-pro, near reference spectroradiometer. It is not to be confused with the x-Rite i1 Display Pro, also called i1d3, which is NOT compatible with the JVC Autocal. It’s average error shouldn’t be further away from reference than 1dE (max), which is very good for the price. That’s the meter I use to train my BasiCColor Discus when I use different calibration software, and the one I plan to use for color (gamut+white point) calibration with the Autocal.

    >snip<

    • The older i1pro (preferably rev.B-D), that isn’t officially supported and has a smaller range (0.2-300nits). Still it can be used with the Autocal software, but I would only recommend it for a color calibration (gamut + white point), not for a gamma calibration. It also needs an initialization more often than the i1pro2, which makes it more annoying to use. See https://xritephoto.com/documents/literature/en/L7-518_i1PRO-i1PRO2_en.pdf for the differences between the two versions.

    Have you got a source for the quoted accuracy for i1pro2?  For what it is worth I don't think there is any particularly good information out there with respect to the accuracy of the i1pro2 for projection or displays - I've seen a couple of sets of data for single meters (including a comparison by Tom Huffman of a single meter against several display techs).  X-rite only quote reflective (paper) reading accuracy in their certification, so even if you have it recertified it doesn't tell you anything about display measurements.

    Going way back, the only really good group-test I've seen of meters, looking at many samples of each, was this one from Dry Creek Photo which included the previous generation i1pro meter:
    https://www.drycreekphoto.com/Learn/Calibration/MonitorCalibrationHardware.html
    They measured mean difference against a "true reference" spectro; a significant batch of i1pro units had a mean dE2000 of 4.3 for standard gamut CCFL LCD and 2.3 for wide gamut RGB LED backlight.  Average dE2000 between units was 2.0 and max 3.5.

    I'd dearly love to see such a comparison of i1pro2 units; there are several changes which claim benefits (such as the wavelength calibration) but I've not really seen anything.  Most of the reviews of these devices tend to be from folk just looking at the functionality.

    Manni

    Re: Basic: Which Meter to use?
    « Reply #40 on: November 12, 2018, 04:51:28 AM »

    Have you got a source for the quoted accuracy for i1pro2?  For what it is worth I don't think there is any particularly good information out there with respect to the accuracy of the i1pro2 for projection or displays - I've seen a couple of sets of data for single meters (including a comparison by Tom Huffman of a single meter against several display techs).  X-rite only quote reflective (paper) reading accuracy in their certification, so even if you have it recertified it doesn't tell you anything about display measurements.

    Going way back, the only really good group-test I've seen of meters, looking at many samples of each, was this one from Dry Creek Photo which included the previous generation i1pro meter:
    https://www.drycreekphoto.com/Learn/Calibration/MonitorCalibrationHardware.html
    They measured mean difference against a "true reference" spectro; a significant batch of i1pro units had a mean dE2000 of 4.3 for standard gamut CCFL LCD and 2.3 for wide gamut RGB LED backlight.  Average dE2000 between units was 2.0 and max 3.5.

    I'd dearly love to see such a comparison of i1pro2 units; there are several changes which claim benefits (such as the wavelength calibration) but I've not really seen anything.  Most of the reviews of these devices tend to be from folk just looking at the functionality.

    Yes, I sent you that link to the drycreekphoto test when you were asking about the Discus :)

    I haven't seen any third party assessment of the i1pro2, I can only say that it's pretty close to reference. Whether it's 1dE or 3dE, I have no idea, but it's below the visible threshold for most of us, unless it's defective. I have no reasons to believe that the dE for the i1pro2 should be lower than for the i1pro, but as I haven't seen any trustworthy 3rd party review I put the manufacturer specs. [EDIT: I changed the 1dE in my post to 1-3dE as it's more likely to be closer to reality].

    My point is that unless you are a pro, it's hard to justify better than the i1pro2. And recertifying it is pointless unless it's defective, as they never adjust anything in a recertification. They measure and send you the measurements. If it's within specs, that's all they do. If it's out of specs, it's defective and you have to pay for repair. Needless to say that I don't recertify my i1pro2 anymore...

    I think the biggest point against the i1pro is the smaller range with a peak of 300nits, rather than the accuracy. Apart from that, they are both "good enough" to be used as a near-reference meter to calibrate a decent colorimeter. I don't use them for anything else than that, but I'll try a few things when I get the rs2000.
    « Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 05:20:57 AM by Manni »

    Yes, I sent you that link to the drycreekphoto test when you were asking about the Discus :)

    I haven't seen any third party assessment of the i1pro2, I can only say that it's pretty close to reference. Whether it's 1dE or 3dE, I have no idea, but it's below the visible threshold for most of us, unless it's defective. I have no reasons to believe that the dE for the i1pro2 should be lower than for the i1pro, but as I haven't seen any trustworthy 3rd party review I put the manufacturer specs. [EDIT: I changed the 1dE in my post to 1-3dE as it's more likely to be closer to reality].

    My point is that unless you are a pro, it's hard to justify better than the i1pro2. And recertifying it is pointless unless it's defective, as they never adjust anything in a recertification. They measure and send you the measurements. If it's within specs, that's all they do. If it's out of specs, it's defective and you have to pay for repair. Needless to say that I don't recertify my i1pro2 anymore...

    I think the biggest point against the i1pro is the smaller range with a peak of 300nits, rather than the accuracy. Apart from that, they are both "good enough" to be used as a near-reference meter to calibrate a decent colorimeter. I don't use them for anything else than that, but I'll try a few things when I get the rs2000.
    Indeed, I'd still love to know how that Discus review worked - they must have been testing one of the (few?) displays it tracks well without spectro profiling as I've had no such luck on any consumer display with it without profiling.

    I don't think x-rite spec 1dE anywhere for displays WRT reference; the 1dE spec is for reference ceramic tiles measured using the inbuilt lamp, and of course that has the benefit of being able to be calibrated (I believe) against the white tile you put under it at calibration time.

    I think even if you are a pro I'm getting less and less convinced these days(!); getting very sceptical in my old age.
    I've had an i1pro rev D,  still have an i1pro2 and now have a JETI 1201 which I'll probably get recalibrated soon as it was a used bargain.  3-4dE between the white measures of these 3 meters seems common for me, which probably puts them all around the 1-3dE circle around reference (perhaps).

    Of course the specs for these meters are (like most specs) not that helpful.  Even on the JETI the spec is x,y +/- 0.002 @ Illuminant A (x 0.4476,y 0.4075).  Worst case that is around 2dE2000, but the same margin of error at D65 100 nits white (who knows, it's unspecified) could be up to 11dE(!). 

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