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Unproportional audio to video home theater system.

alangouger

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Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« on: February 19, 2018, 08:59:05 PM »
Over the years, we've seen plenty of top Home Theater systems covered by magazines where the theater room and speakers cost top dollar then the owner either by the advice of the installer or A/V specialist hangs a two thousand dollar projector. Plenty of people had a good chuckle when seeing this. Well, I am guilty of vice versa. All my money and efforts go to maximizing the video chain. My audio system is downright embarrassing, don't bother asking how bad, its so bad I'm not sharing details:)
Why do I not share the same passion for audio as I do video? Video always took a back seat to audio for many decades and for good reasons. There was nothing exciting with video, back in the day it all started with CRT based TVs. When the first digital projectors arrived they were 480P. It took decades for video to evolve into what we have today. Meanwhile, speakers and preamps received all the attention in most paperback publications. Finally, for all videophiles we have revenge, video has come of age and it's exciting. Meanwhile, speakers are still speakers, nothing has changed, no one has reinvented the speaker.

So what side of the teeter-totter does your system sway and why.

« Last Edit: February 20, 2018, 11:47:10 AM by alangouger »

bmoney

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Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #1 on: February 20, 2018, 03:56:36 AM »
I am an audio first guy. You get more immersed and emotional to the movie with great sound imho. But I do go back and forth with what I concentrate on. They both are  important imho but if I had to choose one

Great sound or great picture. Great sound would win hands down

And i disagree a speaker is a speaker and hasn’t progressed. Not to mention what is being down with speakers (3D audio) is astounding

Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #2 on: February 20, 2018, 04:23:03 AM »
I started off as primarily an audio guy, back in 1990 when we did an add-on to our home, with a decent sound system purchased, based on the Duntech Sovereigns.

This occupied me for several years, but then I tired of it, and it went literally unused for quite a few years.  This room was very large, with many large, bright windows and doorways, so not conducive to video.  We did have a 25" CRT TV way back when, so kids and grandkids could watch cartoons, etc., but this was a negligible effort.

About 2 years ago I had the idea of 'resurrecting' use of the room, and explored adding video.  After months of research, I did it.  It involved buying many light darkening cellular shades, black-out liners, etc., to control the light.  I went with the RS400 and a 160" scope screen.

I augmented the audio system, maintaining the Duntech's as front L/F, with a 7.1.4 Atmos setup, and buying a fellow AVS-er's 8' DIY subwoofer, with 4 18" SI drivers (powered by an iNuke 6000).

I love the huge, room-rattling sound, but have to say that being much more visually oriented than audio in general (my day job is as an Ophthalmologist, and my other passion has been digital photography), so I'm more excited about the visual experience than the audio one.

So I have a reasonable balance on both sides, but I'd have to say the video is more important to me, and I'll spend more time and money optimizing that than the audio.  I never had the 'golden ears' while my vision is excellent, so that may be part of the equation!

Interesting topic.

Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #3 on: February 20, 2018, 07:45:08 AM »
I started off audio, back many years ago. I do try to keep my system performance wise pretty well balanced. Though right now, using an RS640, some may consider my system slanted more toward audio, though the performance of the lamp based JVC hits above its weight class. My LCR's are DIY. The closest speaker to them commercially would be the Triad Cinema Reference. Though mine are larger and active, rather than passive. For as small as my room is, many would consider my audio system overkill, but performance wise, I am very happy with it and do not see myself making any speaker or sub changes.

In fact I have kept this combination of speakers and subs longer than I have ever kept a system. I am that happy with the performance. Video wise, I will keep looking for the next best thing, in my price category.
Mike Garrett
AV Science Sales
585-671-2968
mike@avscience.com

JVC, Sony, Epson, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Onkyo, Stewart, Seymour, Screen Innovations, Screen Excellence, DNP, Carada, Da-Lite, Vutec, Triad, SVS, Martin Logan, Def Tech, RBH, M&K and many other brands.

Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #4 on: February 20, 2018, 08:01:47 AM »
I also starter off with video mainly as well, had various CRT´s for years, reading Alans´ AVSforum till´ my eyes got sore (and even started off the Norwegian AVforum as well...;)), I even had a 65" Barco 808-based monster TV at one point... However, as time progressed I realised that the ultimate movie experience, for me at least, really was a combination of the two which is also why I started developing the screen fabric some 12 years ago as I was annoyed by the fact I had to compromise on image size and quality to get audio how I wanted it (i.e. heard but not seen)... ;) I am a huge Alcons fan, and the setup at this years ISE, combining an immersive 9.1(6).6, a motorised masking frame and the Sony VW5000 really provided what for me is my ultimate movie experience thus far. What sets Alcons apart from the rest is their unique ribbon / planar driver that really produces no distortion whatsoever even at quite excessive SPL´s - as I get really easily fatigued by systems such as the compression driver based Klipsch or JBL the Alcons I can listen to for hours and hours without getting tired or bored. I really hope the same system will be brought to CEDIA later this year!

After having seen the latest gen. LED tiles recently I am more confident than ever that (batcave) projection will survive for quite a while longer, we just need a little boost in brightness and contrast - as well as 4K native all way through - and as long as the room is made out to accommodate a superbly matte white screen it will combat - at least taken into consideration the fact that speakers can be hidden as well - even the super fancy LED tiles moving forward in my opinion. For living rooms, however, I would much rather use a LED tile even with some imperfections - than one of those ALR and/or high-gain screens...

So, in my humble opinion we´ll have a bunch of fun stuff heading our way in both audio and video moving forward - but more than ever the choice of gear and design of the surroundings concerning that specific setup will be more important than ever before. There won´t be "one glove that fits all" for some time yet as far as I can see!
Proudly Representing DreamScreen.no // ScreenAcoustics.com // AT screens & more!

Founder AVforum.no // Norway´s leading AV community since 2002

alangouger

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Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2018, 08:10:10 PM »
And i disagree a speaker is a speaker and hasn’t progressed. Not to mention what is being down with speakers (3D audio) is astounding

Yes, more channels have been added but the speaker is still a cone and resides in a box and many are not very efficient.

Maybe someday we will have a new way to reproduce sound with very high efficiency.


Though mine are larger and active, rather than passive.

Active has some advantages, sounds like a nice system Mike.


I am more confident than ever that (batcave) projection will survive for quite a while longer, we just need a little boost in brightness and contrast - as well as 4K native all way through -

And a good screen, I think you have that covered :)

Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2018, 07:41:33 AM »
Yes, more channels have been added but the speaker is still a cone and resides in a box and many are not very efficient.

Maybe someday we will have a new way to reproduce sound with very high efficiency.


Active has some advantages, sounds like a nice system Mike.


And a good screen, I think you have that covered :)

I used to go to CEDIA and after listening to some of the better HT demo's, walk away thinking, what do I need to do to get my system to sound that good and have that kind of impact. For the last three CEDIA's I have walked away, still impressed with my system's performance.
Mike Garrett
AV Science Sales
585-671-2968
mike@avscience.com

JVC, Sony, Epson, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Onkyo, Stewart, Seymour, Screen Innovations, Screen Excellence, DNP, Carada, Da-Lite, Vutec, Triad, SVS, Martin Logan, Def Tech, RBH, M&K and many other brands.

Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2018, 10:48:01 AM »
I used to go to CEDIA and after listening to some of the better HT demo's, walk away thinking, what do I need to do to get my system to sound that good and have that kind of impact. For the last three CEDIA's I have walked away, still impressed with my system's performance.

Those TPL-150´s high power ribbons are really fantastic drivers, no wonder you´re not impressed by most compression driver based systems at CEDIA! It´s weird stuff, the compression driver has been around for some 100 years, so Alan is certainly on to something in terms of innovation in audio seemingly not happening. That´s why I´m so enthusiastic about those Alcons systems, these guys have actually made some major innovative steps - too bad it takes this long to spread the gospel... It´s like Tom, CEO of Alcons said; if you want to introduce a new system to the market it is not enough to simply be better; you need to be stellar - and even then, it might take years and years... So; as far as I can tell, the audio market does not seem very keen on new tech either, perhaps all that snake oil rubbish has done some serious damage!? When specs can´t be trusted and opinions are as diverse as they are in terms of audio preferences it seems much harder to find those specific areas in which to innovate.

However, in my opinion, a highly AT screen fabric is indeed a "sound" innovation though, so there´s that at least... ;)

Also, another potentially interesting, albeit quite possibly "snake oilish", is Harmans new reflective sound system. As their new LED tiles are obviously not acoustically transparent, they place some speakers on top of the screen to produce the mids, while the top frequencies are simply bounced off of the screen from a speaker array placed in the back of the cinema auditorium. I have never been very impressed by any kind of reflective system in the residential area, like those Atmos "ceiling reflective" speaker systems for example, but as I have not heard it and some reports indicate it might work I guess hearing is believing - or not so - at some point.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2018, 12:06:45 PM by lygren »
Proudly Representing DreamScreen.no // ScreenAcoustics.com // AT screens & more!

Founder AVforum.no // Norway´s leading AV community since 2002

Re: Unproportional audio to video home theater system.
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2018, 08:53:09 AM »
I could live quite happily live with a 2.1 system, behind a DIY acoustically transparent screen, with a JVC B stock projector, in a  smallish room, with a bit of depth to spare. 

Simplistic, but pretty awesome.