AVS Discussions
Projectors => CRT Projectors => Topic started by: stridsvognen on November 21, 2016, 10:23:12 AM
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I have a SONY G90 ill try dig out and fire up.
The G90 might be the best CRT projector standard from factory, but its typical Sony, so its overly complex build.. Lots of features build in that we wont need that is limiting bandwidth and image quality, very much like they still build digital projectors.
It might be possible to replace the SONY videochain with a specially build videochain based on the Marquee Neckboards, and a add on board, time will show.
So this thread should be for all G90 related CRT talk..
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Sounds interesting but I'm not holding my breath ;) Gabor is still tweaking the Marquee mods and I'd think the G90 would be like going down a rabbit hole. I won't be surprised to see you guys get something up and running but smoothing out the quirks is what will likely eat up a lot of time. Just make sure that you get rid of that streaking issue.
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Well first i need to get a screen up and the projector running.. I had my brother helping me getting it upstairs, and that pretty much killed us both, so there is no way ill be asking him to help me getting it back down again, ill need to make it work where it is.
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It sure would be nice to get a positive synergy effect between the simplicity in a Marquee and more complicated "plug an play" G90.
Not sure if a marqueeG90 merge will make a difference in picture quality.
The only thing i do not like about the G90 is when the Dallas chip internal battery need replaising or if something hard to replace component go bad on the YA board.
The 110 kg G90 is not easy do move around that is correct, but with the 8 handles and some transport and lifting tools it is quite easy compared to a piano.....
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It sure would be nice to get a positive synergy effect between the simplicity in a Marquee and more complicated "plug an play" G90.
Not sure if a marqueeG90 merge will make a difference in picture quality.
The only thing i do not like about the G90 is when the Dallas chip internal battery need replaising or if something hard to replace component go bad on the YA board.
The 110 kg G90 is not easy do move around that is correct, but with the 8 handles and some transport and lifting tools it is quite easy compared to a piano.....
The Dallas ship is changed in Your G90 :)
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What kind of light output do you guys get out of the G90.?
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The Dallas ship is changed in Your G90 :)
Hi Diddern, yes PJ told me some of the history of my G90 so hopefully that chip will keep the settings for 5-10 more years. :)
I was thinking more of the Marquee design with a more flexible litium powered battery for the setup memory, so when the voltage get to low, the user just have to solder on a new power cell with the same voltage and the projector do not loose more settings than the current setup.
I like that solution a little bit better than if the internal power in the dallas ship go bad, there is a risk of spot burning and toasting the tubes and the memory of the chip have more of the "low level" factory logs and settings so the G90 will loose a lot more information than the current installation setup.
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What kind of light output do you guys get out of the G90.?
Can easy do 14-16Fl in 106 inch
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Hi Diddern, yes PJ told me some of the history of my G90 so hopefully that chip will keep the settings for 5-10 more years. :)
I was thinking more of the Marquee design with a more flexible litium powered battery for the setup memory, so when the voltage get to low, the user just have to solder on a new power cell with the same voltage and the projector do not loose more settings than the current setup.
I like that solution a little bit better than if the internal power in the dallas ship go bad, there is a risk of spot burning and toasting the tubes and the memory of the chip have more of the "low level" factory logs and settings so the G90 will loose a lot more information than the current installation setup.
The G90 U have is a great CRT. And by far the best CRT I have seen in real life. :)
Adjusted by professionals that know CRT.
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Can easy do 14-16Fl in 106 inch
Neutral gain screen.?
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Neutral gain screen.?
Yes 1.0-1.1(don't remember the exact screen value, can measure different) gain white. But ended some lower than 14-16Fl. To save the tubes, and for best performance. I guess around 10-11FL.
Then Ask4me2 picked it up. :)
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What kind of light output do you guys get out of the G90.?
At the moment the G90 setup have approx. 11 fL on a 90" 1.1 gain 16:9 screen using the maximum "16:9" area on the tubes. I like to have the contrast at moderate levels on CRT projectors to get the best picture without pushing the tubes, and to enjoy the "dark side" of the CRT technology... To start with i calibrated the G90 with 16fL to, but i think the green tube is running a little hard in the G90 so i turned the contrast down. If i want higher light output i use a JVC "lamp valve" with A-lens in another home cinema setup :)
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At the moment the G90 setup have approx. 11 fL on a 90" 1.1 gain 16:9 screen using the maximum "16:9" area on the tubes. I like to have the contrast at moderate levels on CRT projectors to get the best picture without pushing the tubes, and to enjoy the "dark side" of the CRT technology... To start with i calibrated the G90 with 16fL to, but i think the green tube is running a little hard in the G90 so i turned the contrast down. If i want higher light output i use a JVC "lamp valve" with A-lens in another home cinema setup :)
The G90 is a light canon and if run as such a tube toaster.. So guess its wise to turn it down, at 11fl on a 90" it should last quite a while.. I seen a Marquee with lug tubes run at candle power for around 1000 hours, and show slight hint of wear on green, and marquee with LCP tubes with 3500 hours with no hint at all.. So i wonder if the fine grained phosfor in the hi res tubes are the main sinner, i would love to see how a G90 with LCP tubes and some better lenses would look like.
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The G90 U have is a great CRT. And by far the best CRT I have seen in real life. :)
Adjusted by professionals that know CRT.
Yes this G90 is nice, and the setup i got to see when i picked it up as PJ was spot on. :)
The picture resolution and sharpness color, cold to warm convergence and picture geometry looked 100%, and i was thinking of all that work that had been done and was reset when the projector was lifted and moved away from where it was installed....
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At the moment the G90 setup have approx. 11 fL on a 90" 1.1 gain 16:9 screen using the maximum "16:9" area on the tubes. I like to have the contrast at moderate levels on CRT projectors to get the best picture without pushing the tubes, and to enjoy the "dark side" of the CRT technology... To start with i calibrated the G90 with 16fL to, but i think the green tube is running a little hard in the G90 so i turned the contrast down. If i want higher light output i use a JVC "lamp valve" with A-lens in another home cinema setup :)
Cool to have 2 cinema`s in your home. I know what you have :) Also agree enjoy the "dark side" correct adjusted, one of the coolest features on a CRT .
And you will measure almost every CRT to infinite contrast. That's because tubes shut more or less off.
And the max "used/available" contrast around 16000-60000:1 depend on type CRT, adjustments and specifications.
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The G90 is a light canon and if run as such a tube toaster.. So guess its wise to turn it down, at 11fl on a 90" it should last quite a while.. I seen a Marquee with lug tubes run at candle power for around 1000 hours, and show slight hint of wear on green, and marquee with LCP tubes with 3500 hours with no hint at all.. So i wonder if the fine grained phosfor in the hi res tubes are the main sinner, i would love to see how a G90 with LCP tubes and some better lenses would look like.
Yes, the fine grained phosphor may also have different cemical properties from the LCP or may have been applied in a thinner layer inside the tube face to get a sharper look but also more easy to burn and wear out.
I am quite sensitive for 1x chip color wheel DLP rainbow effects, and can sometimes notice some of the same memory effect from the different CRT tubes and phosphors. In the G90 it is the blue phosphor with a little green edge that i sometimes see, in Marquee with LCP tubes, the green with some yellow.to red shows up.
Have you seen some of these same effects stridsvognen?
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Cool to have 2 cinema`s in your home. I know what you have :) Also agree enjoy the "dark side" correct adjusted, one of the coolest features on a CRT .
And you will measure almost every CRT to infinite contrast. That's because tubes shut more or less off.
And the max "used/available" contrast around 16000-60000:1 depend on type CRT, adjustments and specifications.
Its very normal that CRT clip black to some degree, and you have to elevate the raster/ black level, and the main reason to use the Marquee instead of the G90 is that its possible to rebuild the analog videochain to work much better with the reference level signal out of the dac, the G90 image looks to me in comparison very washed out, and im sure it has to do with the very very long overly complicated signal path in the G90.. And thats why its wishfull thinking to implement a Marquee alike videochain like what Gjaky is working on, and get the image quality from a Marquee combined with the focus, geometry and deflection system of the G90
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Its very normal that CRT clip black to some degree, and you have to elevate the raster/ black level, and the main reason to use the Marquee instead of the G90 is that its possible to rebuild the analog videochain to work much better with the reference level signal out of the dac, the G90 image looks to me in comparison very washed out, and im sure it has to do with the very very long overly complicated signal path in the G90.. And thats why its wishfull thinking to implement a Marquee alike videochain like what Gjaky is working on, and get the image quality from a Marquee combined with the focus, geometry and deflection system of the G90
This is preference what kind of CRT you like, just like another prospective me D-ila over SXRD digital. There have been tests with G90 compared to newest marquees with different mod at Curt Palme forum, they say the opposite of you statement here. But again that's how it will always be. Some like A and some like B. I know that you know Marquee and got the image you like out of it. And Per J have done the same with the G90 that Ask4me2 now own and that looked great..
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There have been tests with G90 compared to newest marquees with different mod at Curt Palme forum, they say the opposite of you statement here.
Could you point me to the thread with those tests; don't recall seeing that on Curt's site. IMO, it's a shame that the G90 signal path is so convoluted because the focus system really is superior and they perform FAR more consistently out of the box than Marquees do. When Kurt set up my PJ back in the fall he spent 40+ hours dialing things in and a big part of that was chasing down issues like HVPS cross talk, testing Sony and Marquee yokes, etc. It took a long time because each change resulted in magnetics and color calibration being redone and evaluated. Then throw in the mix the radiance/HDfury and you see why it becomes an all encompassing task.
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Could you point me to the thread with those tests; don't recall seeing that on Curt's site. IMO, it's a shame that the G90 signal path is so convoluted because the focus system really is superior and they perform FAR more consistently out of the box than Marquees do. When Kurt set up my PJ back in the fall he spent 40+ hours dialing things in and a big part of that was chasing down issues like HVPS cross talk, testing Sony and Marquee yokes, etc. It took a long time because each change resulted in magnetics and color calibration being redone and evaluated. Then throw in the mix the radiance/HDfury and you see why it becomes an all encompassing task.
No doubt that Kurt can set up Marquee. I know that.
But the only way to see if the Marquee is visibly better is with a side by side test, and both would have to be adjusted by persons with knowledge to the same standards/calibration. G90 is much more complex and new tec compared to marquee, That's also why modd have good effect on Marquees. They are not good without mod, my opinion.
If someone says a G90 is a walk in the park CRT, then no knowledge about it. Yes you can get a crappy picture on it if you don't know all the different settings and what it do, and how to set it up. But a Marquee will give a less processed picture overall YES.
But processing is not always bad if someone feel its better. This also is what you and others feel about a CRT or other tec.
What you like about your Marquee can also be not liked by others. You and me or others can say what we like with our setup and adore but can`t say that it is better. We are different. That is just you're or mine or others opinion.
About the tread on Curts forum Just look you find it its there. Will take me long time to find this again, when I don't remember the threads name. I don't care about it.
Maybe some otter person here know then please post. The poster CMJohnsen
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No doubt that Kurt can set up Marquee. I know that.
But the only way to see if the Marquee is visibly better is with a side by side test, and both would have to be adjusted by persons with knowledge to the same standards/calibration. G90 is much more complex and new tec compared to marquee, That's also why modd have good effect on Marquees. They are not good without mod, my opinion.
If someone says a G90 is a walk in the park CRT, then no knowledge about it. Yes you can get a crappy picture on it if you don't know all the different settings and what it do, and how to set it up. But a Marquee will give a less processed picture overall YES.
But processing is not always bad if someone feel its better. This also is what you and others feel about a CRT or other tec.
What you like about your Marquee can also be not liked by others. You and me or others can say what we like with our setup and adore but can`t say that it is better. We are different. That is just you're or mine or others opinion.
About the tread on Curts forum Just look you find it its there. Will take me long time to find this again, when I don't remember the threads name. I don't care about it.
Maybe some otter person here know then please post. The poster CMJohnsen
I have both a G90 and a few different Marquee.. Just lost one today.. I did compare the Marquee and the G90 way back before the Marquee was able to perform as it is today, and i do have mods and different dac solutions for the G90..
This thread was kind of me picking up on the G90 again to maybe see if it was possible to tweak the videochain using Gjakys mods, and Marquee neckboards in a G90.. I posted about my G90 experiences back then, and sure a lot of people got upset even they had never owned a Marquee, and far from had a clue how to operate one.
There is a few wery simple performance parameters on the G90 that is easy demonstrated, and im pretty sure nobody will disagree that it simply have terrible ansi contrast when looking at the image.. It might not be any huge measurable difference on a simple low res ansi pattern, but with hi res movie content im pretty sure if we all sit together looking at the same screen you would pick the same projector.. Now the Marquee is a terrible machine in many ways, and cant say its not performing worse from standard, i think it might.. And even most of the mods for the marquee introduce more problems than it solves.. So having close to 30 Marquee projectors and huge piles of different standard and moddet boards tubes dacs and whatever have shown results from terribl to fantastic.. And a lot in between.. As Justin tells its a tiresome process to trow around boards and find the right combination.. So having both the G90 and the Marquee projectors in the same house, having done them side by side, and having the option to do it again if i desire makes me think its ok to have a opinion about it, and think that people that has not went true the same trouble testing and evaluating both might go do so before they form a final judgment on the matter.
You guys know your always welcome to post some killer screenshots from the G90, testpatterns and whatever to demonstrate how well it performs, or to show why you think it is better, or why your G90 is better than all the other G90 projectors out there.. And ill keep up getting mine up running again.
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I have both a G90 and a few different Marquee.. Just lost one today.. I did compare the Marquee and the G90 way back before the Marquee was able to perform as it is today, and i do have mods and different dac solutions for the G90..
This thread was kind of me picking up on the G90 again to maybe see if it was possible to tweak the videochain using Gjakys mods, and Marquee neckboards in a G90.. I posted about my G90 experiences back then, and sure a lot of people got upset even they had never owned a Marquee, and far from had a clue how to operate one.
There is a few wery simple performance parameters on the G90 that is easy demonstrated, and im pretty sure nobody will disagree that it simply have terrible ansi contrast when looking at the image.. It might not be any huge measurable difference on a simple low res ansi pattern, but with hi res movie content im pretty sure if we all sit together looking at the same screen you would pick the same projector.. Now the Marquee is a terrible machine in many ways, and cant say its not performing worse from standard, i think it might.. And even most of the mods for the marquee introduce more problems than it solves.. So having close to 30 Marquee projectors and huge piles of different standard and moddet boards tubes dacs and whatever have shown results from terribl to fantastic.. And a lot in between.. As Justin tells its a tiresome process to trow around boards and find the right combination.. So having both the G90 and the Marquee projectors in the same house, having done them side by side, and having the option to do it again if i desire makes me think its ok to have a opinion about it, and think that people that has not went true the same trouble testing and evaluating both might go do so before they form a final judgment on the matter.
You guys know your always welcome to post some killer screenshots from the G90, testpatterns and whatever to demonstrate how well it performs, or to show why you think it is better, or why your G90 is better than all the other G90 projectors out there.. And ill keep up getting mine up running again.
Hi Strids.
The G90 is extremely complex and NOT a walk in the park compared to the Marquee. But I think you know that. Per J used a long time to get the picture that it ended with, it has all. And all 1:1 patterns I have seen of CRT on net is not any better., CRT limitations. Also I think screenshots are totally worthless and don't prove anything, that's why I stopped at other forums and wont start again.
Why I and others think the G90 is better, its 10 years newer than any Marquee, better tec. That's also why mods on the G90 it is hard to find, if there is any.
You think the marquee is the best CRT and easy say that you pick that before anything else in 2017. I wont,,,, And you and me are free to have own feelings. I see the positive and negative in each tec. And don't have CRT, but still I find the CRT image special and still like it. And by far the G90 the best I have seen yet. But all 9" adjusted correct with knowledge I don't think the image will be way off any marquee. But I might be wrong have not seen yours :).
But I hope that me and Per can have a look when your Cinema is up and running, Denmark is not far.
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It would actually be quite easy to demonstrate the difference with screenshots.. Here is a example from the last days, where i shot a standard and a moddet marquee netflix streaming running 195Mhz, both are fast setups, the last/ moddet did not focus as well, think the glycol might be getting bad, same comparison is easy made with a G90.. Forget about colors and calibration.. just look at the contrast and detail level.
The G90 will do a nice 1:1 pattern, but if you study the pattern closely or if you would scope the signal you would notice a lot of peaking distortion.. Thats just how that is, and a standard Marquee look just as bad when peaked to look the same on pattern, and i dont see any standard CRT that have any decent out of black performance.. You might think its reference, i think its bad, but that dont change that we each like what we like, but at the end of the day i very much doubt you would pick differently than me if looking on the same 2 projectors, the biggest problem is that thae Marquee normaly fails to perform a decent image, and there is a huge pile of options as it feels like there is no 2 the same Marquee, and the G90 is a G90, its like always the same.. So its consistent performance no doubt about that.
And i also stated multiple times that if the choise came between the G90 and a good digital, i would most likely go digital.
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It would actually be quite easy to demonstrate the difference with screenshots.. Here is a example from the last days, where i shot a standard and a moddet marquee netflix streaming running 195Mhz, both are fast setups, the last/ moddet did not focus as well, think the glycol might be getting bad, same comparison is easy made with a G90.. Forget about colors and calibration.. just look at the contrast and detail level.
The G90 will do a nice 1:1 pattern, but if you study the pattern closely or if you would scope the signal you would notice a lot of peaking distortion.. Thats just how that is, and a standard Marquee look just as bad when peaked to look the same on pattern, and i dont see any standard CRT that have any decent out of black performance.. You might think its reference, i think its bad, but that dont change that we each like what we like, but at the end of the day i very much doubt you would pick differently than me if looking on the same 2 projectors, the biggest problem is that thae Marquee normaly fails to perform a decent image, and there is a huge pile of options as it feels like there is no 2 the same Marquee, and the G90 is a G90, its like always the same.. So its consistent performance no doubt about that.
And i also stated multiple times that if the choise came between the G90 and a good digital, i would most likely go digital.
To judge contrast from a screenshot is totally impossible. This goes under the term misinformation.
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Here is a zoom of the background showing the difference of these 2 pictures, where its visible that black is cleaner, and bright parts are cleaner and brighter.. Same camera and same conditions, source and so on, 2 pretty identical projectors just with different boards/ videochain.. Ill say that a cleaner black, and brighter brights, and better defined details is better contrast/ dynamic in the image. And that one videochain handle colors better than the other is just a addet bonus feature from the addet bandwidth and less noise in the analog domain. On a low res calibration window they perform the same measured grayscale tracking, but we all know how useless that can turn out in a real image containing a more complex composition. And it would be interesting to see how the G90 videochain fare in this regard in direct comparison.. And it would be great if everybody that actually have a G90 would help ilustrating that, and even better if you have a alternative CRT projector as well.
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It would actually be quite easy to demonstrate the difference with screenshots.. Here is a example from the last days, where i shot a standard and a moddet marquee netflix streaming running 195Mhz, both are fast setups, the last/ moddet did not focus as well, think the glycol might be getting bad, same comparison is easy made with a G90.. Forget about colors and calibration.. just look at the contrast and detail level.
The G90 will do a nice 1:1 pattern, but if you study the pattern closely or if you would scope the signal you would notice a lot of peaking distortion.. Thats just how that is, and a standard Marquee look just as bad when peaked to look the same on pattern, and i dont see any standard CRT that have any decent out of black performance.. You might think its reference, i think its bad, but that dont change that we each like what we like, but at the end of the day i very much doubt you would pick differently than me if looking on the same 2 projectors, the biggest problem is that thae Marquee normaly fails to perform a decent image, and there is a huge pile of options as it feels like there is no 2 the same Marquee, and the G90 is a G90, its like always the same.. So its consistent performance no doubt about that.
And i also stated multiple times that if the choise came between the G90 and a good digital, i would most likely go digital.
The compartment you show gives me a indication that one is TERRIBLE wrong adjusted, easy to see.
And the mods form MP does nothing? like you say: "So my question is what is the mods do.?" For just some time ago the MP mods where the best in the world. What happened?
I wonder the same after seeing his pictures.
This because he does little to get the max out of his projector and how to show what his mods do, like I see it.
And different camera, different screen, different calibration, different shutter time on cam, different camera! adjustments, camera knowledge, different qualifications on adjusting inn the CRT will this affect the picture?.
Answer is YES much.
Not hard to see that your Marquee is more correct adjusted and also better focus and picture skills.
And what so ever Contrast cant be judged form a photo :)
Out of black performance on CRT is also "knowledge" about what to do to get it right. Even on Barco/G90
The G90 does this 100% perfect what I measured and saw.
And your "opinion" (And i also stated multiple times that if the choice came between the G90 and a good digital, I would most likely go digital.) I cant agree/disagree to your statement. ;)
I have other preferences than CRT.
I will say it like this, if you like how the Marquee CRT give out the picture stick with that, same with Barco or G90 today in 2017.
Most important to enjoy your hobby. I would put money on, that if you got someone that really know G90 to set it up correct, then to the same light output and same preference calibrated standards, same player and settings like your Marquee the differences would be minor in a instant switch. And you and me can easy get a G90 to look better than a Marquee or the otter way around. That is just how we like the test to come out. That's why many factors have to be in place, to do this right. Also have no favor in technology or brand, and accept the outcome even if you don't like it.
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The MP mods i had was always repaired/ further improved by myself, and thinking back i actually never had a set of pure MP neckboards, as they always seemed to be problematic.
Now regarding the G90 VS Marquee, the hole difference is the analog videochain. The G90 is good from a standard CRT projector standpoint.. But its pretty locked up regarding improvements as the bottlenecks in the videochain design calls for a hole new videochain wich might not be so simple.. The Marquee pretty much sucks standard, but the way they made the videochain makes it possible to make it perform like no other CRT.. And that do make a difference.. One thing is what you measure. but no measurement can tell you if you have a good or bad image.. A G90 might have around 100Mhz peaked bandwidth, they pretty much is all 75-100Mhz.. The marquee can be made to do a 250Mhz bandwidth better than any of the others do 100Mhz.. And yes that is a bit like comparing a 720P to a 1080P projector on resolution, no matter how sharp the 720P projector is it just wont help it to display the detail level of a 1080P source.. Thats not rocket sience.. Then there is other parameters like contrast wich on -crt is very much tied together with videochain performance, as noise will easily put a kind of invisible haze/ layer of light on top of the image, might bump up the light output, but at the same time lower the contrast.. I think quite some of the light output in the G90 is comming from noise, and some might be whatever light the tubes can transmit to each other in the chassis not having closed light sheldings on the rear end of the tubes. Sure the G90 is the best if its the best you have ever seen.. And yes the most of the Marquee projectors looks quite bad, moddet or not.. Im documenting a difference using the same conditions, same cameraman camera and everything else except the projector.. And ill do the same setting up the G90.. Now adjusting the G90 might be a bit funky as its not very intuitive to use.. But its still not rocket sience, as it has a drive and G2 for each tube and a gamma feature.. And thats pretty much that.. Sure it sounds much better to claim its setup by a expert.. Ill think the only person having the right to claim that would be Craig Rounds.. And try ask him what was the best CRT projector he have ever seen.
Limited experience or understanding of other than what you have or have seen dont realy help much in convincing others that what you have is the best. So ill recommend you to leave the one CRT vs another debate to those who actualy have and run multiple CRT projectors, as its kind of waste of time for us who have to argue the case with some that dont have any kind of documentation or testing to offer.
I started this thread to potentialy improve the G90 with the help of Gjakys very interesting videochain, if possible.. And lift it to outperform the Marquee.. Your welcome to join, but first you must go get a G90 and even better a Marquee to, and understand how that one works, and how to work around its issues.
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Yes this G90 is nice, and the setup i got to see when i picked it up as PJ was spot on. :)
What player/ Blueray player du you use?
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Can wait to see it in real life Strids, Per J and me wait for a invitation in your Cinema.
Will be nice to se a great Marquee that I know is calibrated and set up correct . You are also of course welcome to Norway but at the time we have no CRT up and running..
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the biggest problem is that thae Marquee normaly fails to perform a decent image, and there is a huge pile of options as it feels like there is no 2 the same Marquee, and the G90 is a G90, its like always the same.. So its consistent performance no doubt about that.
That is the truth; no two Marquees are the same and squeaking the max levelof performance requires a lot of time and parts and most importantly patience. G90's are consistent but thus far have not been as tweakable.
Kurt is the only person I know of that is capable of displaying both models in the same environment. Maybe he should acquire or fabricate a giant 15' wide 1.0 gain screen and fire both PJ's onto it simultaneously; would be pretty cool. I think that would warant a meet 8)
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And you and me can easy get a G90 to look better than a Marquee
No I am not buying this statement and having seen Overclockers ulitmate G90 stack I will stick with
the Marquee setup by kurt everytime.
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No I am not buying this statement and having seen Overclockers ulitmate G90 stack I will stick with
the Marquee setup by kurt everytime.
read again J, you understand what I mean. :)
And you and me can easy get a G90 to look better than a Marquee or the otter way around. That is just how we like the test to come out.
Fact and truth, but I leave it there.
The Marquee that you guys have might be much better. I cant say have not seen it, and will easy be seen when me and Per have a look :) We have seen so many different CRTs ;)
But again what me you and others like in a CRT picture can be different correct?
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read again J, you understand what I mean. :)
And you and me can easy get a G90 to look better than a Marquee or the otter way around. That is just how we like the test to come out.
Fact and truth, but I leave it there.
The Marquee that you guys have might be much better. I cant say have not seen it, and will easy be seen when me and Per have a look :) We have seen so many different CRTs ;)
But again what me you and others like in a CRT picture can be different correct?
It can be different, but it dont very often happen if your looking at the same thing.. Im pretty sure you will also prefer better ansi contrast resolution and color reproduction, out of black performance and so on and on.. And ill be able to kill any G90 any time of the week with a Marquee.. As long as i have free hands to do with it what needs to be done.. Again some of the point with this thread was potentially to mod a G90 with a Marquee/ Gjaky videochain, make it better than a Marquee. or on pair with it, but taking advantage of the G90 superior operating and magnetic system.
Your standpoint might very well be true if you battle standard projectors, but why should we settel with less when there is actually more to get.. We dont need to be stuck in the past just because we have CRT projectors.
I want the best i can get, and having both Marquee and G90 i know what they bothe do well or not, and even that the marquee is troublesome, its not impossible, and the end result far far overtakes any other CRT i come acreoss, or HT Digital for that matter.
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It can be different, but it dont very often happen if your looking at the same thing.. Im pretty sure you will also prefer better ansi contrast resolution and color reproduction, out of black performance and so on and on.. And ill be able to kill any G90 any time of the week with a Marquee.. As long as i have free hands to do with it what needs to be done.. Again some of the point with this thread was potentially to mod a G90 with a Marquee/ Gjaky videochain, make it better than a Marquee. or on pair with it, but taking advantage of the G90 superior operating and magnetic system.
Your standpoint might very well be true if you battle standard projectors, but why should we settel with less when there is actually more to get.. We dont need to be stuck in the past just because we have CRT projectors.
I want the best i can get, and having both Marquee and G90 i know what they bothe do well or not, and even that the marquee is troublesome, its not impossible, and the end result far far overtakes any other CRT i come acreoss, or HT Digital for that matter.
And I think it is important so specify that the last sentence I bolded out is your opinion, and it is not shared by many others.
I also think a Per J setup G90 would be a hard match for a Stridvognen setup Marquee. ;)
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Again the main advantage of the Marquee is the simplicity of its video chain.. None of the CRT projectors are build for HD as it looks today.. I have NIB NOS 2011 build Marquee projectors here, with different board revisions.. Even worse videochain, but slightly better HDM board.. At the time they were contructed there was no DAC cards, it was all analog inputs SD resolution video.. NTSC mostly.. The weakness of the G90 is its videochain, over complicated and complex, and no way possible to save, every stage create distortions and noise, there might be 10 of those in a G90 where we have 3 in the moddet Marquee.. Plus the Marquee is the only projector where anyone have had a reference level all the way to the neckboards without clamping, who always messes up the low level performance..
So the G90 is in many ways the ultimate CRT.. But the videochain sucks for HD Blu Ray.. But it will do ok if kept below 150Mhz pixel clock.. thats 1080P 60 or 817P 72. Now im running the marquee 1080P 72 195Mhz and 817P 96hz 197Mhz..
Thats a lot higher pixel clock, but i still maintain a better cleaner signal than the G90 at 100Mhz.. So ill ask again, who wants a 720P DLP over a 1080P JVC RS600, The DLP will with no doubt be sharper, and accept 1080P and display a image, but low level sucks. Thats pretty much how i see the difference between the G90 VS ultimate Marquee.. And why i would like the Marquee / Gjaky videochain implemented in the G90 using the unike Marquee neckboards, and Gjakys high bandwidth input stage directly on the neckboards.. I dont have a problem with you likeing the 720P G90 or 909 or standard Marquee.. This thread is about making a HD resolution projector out of the G90 if possible, Maybe replace the crappy HD10F lenses and do some light controle of the tube bell in the chassis.
So who actually has a G90 and is willing to contribute with screenshots and measurements to document the G90 performance as is..? Im not looking for subjective opinions about how you prefer a G70 or a old 7" CRT projector showing laserdisc 20 years ago.. Objective usefull contributions to the tread to help put the standard G90 performance in the past, and make it a HD capable projector with superior performance on pair with what we can do with the Marquee today, maybe even with a twist..
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Again some of the point with this thread was potentially to mod a G90 with a Marquee/ Gjaky videochain, make it better than a Marquee. or on pair with it, but taking advantage of the G90 superior operating and magnetic system.
That's exactly the point of this thread and now its gone off the rails (as it usually does anytime Diddern and Andreas show up...) turning into a G90 vs. Modded Marquee debate or simply looking to argue with Kurt. How many forums has this crap gone on and contributed to people getting banned; what are we up to 4 now??? Quite frankly, for this thread I'm entirely uninterested in any opinions on which CRT PJ you feel is the best.
FACT: G90 has superior electronics, focus system and overall consistency when compared to a stock Marquee.
FACT: Properly modded Marquee has the highest BW video chain of any 9" CRT.
HYPOTHESIS: A G90 with Gabor's modifications may combine the best of both worlds in one platform.
Now in addition to Gabor's potential modifications if anyone can contribute other modifications or theories on how to IMPROVE the G90's performance then it belongs in this thread.
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I was invited by Greg to this thread, I am not the one opening the door talking about Marquee in this G90 thread then read again.
I have no intention to argue with Kurt, or others.
I just telling my experience on a G90, after what i have seen, and that was great..
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I was invited by Greg to this thread, I am not the one opening the dor talking about Marquee in this G90 thread then read again.
I have no intention to argue with Kurt, or others.
I just telling my experience on a G90, after what i have seen, and that was great..
Welcome and very insightful look forward to Kurt posting his findings with his G90 as this will help other G90 owners :)
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So anyone want to post some G90 screenshots showing the information level the G90 can pass, and maybe some calibrations, or other relevant performance data.. ?
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So anyone want to post some G90 screenshots showing the information level the G90 can pass, and maybe some calibrations, or other relevant performance data.. ?
Fire up you G90 and make it happen. What you waiting for? Already solved the Marquee now solve the G90.
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So anyone want to post some G90 screenshots showing the information level the G90 can pass, and maybe some calibrations, or other relevant performance data.. ?
You have one, fire it up. :)
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You have one, fire it up. :)
Dont worry i will when time and space alows.. In the mean time all constructive and objective input from G90 owners are welcome, but please be specifik and try document it with pictures and measurements if possible.