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What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017

What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« on: November 24, 2016, 06:52:07 PM »
Here is my guess:

1. RS400/500/600 replacements to have laser, E-shift and low lag. Keeping close to current prices.
2. RSXXXX laser native 4K projector with around 2,000 lumens, priced between RS600 and RS4500.
3. RS4500

Note, to keep a projector in the $4,000 MSRP price point JVC could require the RS400 replacement to be lamp based. JVC could even lower the price and improve the performance slightly, along with adding a low lag mode. Not everybody is going to be able to afford laser and or 4K, so a lamp based entry level E-shift model with improved performance and lower lag would have a lot of appeal, compared to the competition at that price point.
Mike Garrett
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Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2016, 08:27:16 PM »
I pretty much agree your guesses although I would think it would be hard to keep the RS400 near its current price with laser so maybe it stays lamp - and if so, maybe they drop the MSRP a bit on it to try and gain a larger share of the relatively lower priced projector market.

I could see the potential native 4K lamp based unit around $12995 MSRP.  I would expect it to be a bit less than the Sony 675ES (or whatever Sony might replace it with).

 
« Last Edit: November 24, 2016, 08:31:10 PM by DavidHir »

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Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2016, 05:44:27 AM »
if it goes to laser same price...Ill be upgrading

Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2016, 07:35:16 AM »
I think a laser E-shift projector with 1,800 to 2,000 calibrated lumens would sell very well.
Mike Garrett
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JVC, Sony, Epson, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Onkyo, Stewart, Seymour, Screen Innovations, Screen Excellence, DNP, Carada, Da-Lite, Vutec, Triad, SVS, Martin Logan, Def Tech, RBH, M&K and many other brands.

Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2016, 08:33:49 AM »
Here is my guess:

1. RS400/500/600 replacements to have laser, E-shift and low lag. Keeping close to current prices.
2. RSXXXX laser native 4K projector with around 2,000 lumens, priced between RS600 and RS4500.
3. RS4500

Note, to keep a projector in the $4,000 MSRP price point JVC could require the RS400 replacement to be lamp based. JVC could even lower the price and improve the performance slightly, along with adding a low lag mode. Not everybody is going to be able to afford laser and or 4K, so a lamp based entry level E-shift model with improved performance and lower lag would have a lot of appeal, compared to the competition at that price point.

I've been leaning towards waiting a bit longer to upgrade and even though I know this is just a guess I think it's convinced me to hold off upgrading the projector just a while longer.
Equipment list:
Video: JVC RS500, 138" Elite EZ Frame 2:35:1 Screen, Oppo UDP-203, DirecTV Genie,
Audio: Denon X4000, Mains: Paradigm Prestige 85F, Center: Paradigm Prestige 55C Sides: Paradigm Monitor 7 V6, Rears: Polk TSI100, Subwoofer: HSU VTF3 MK4.
Other: Monster Power HTS-5100, GIK Acoustic Room Treatments, HD Fury Linker

Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2016, 08:52:44 AM »
if it goes to laser same price...Ill be upgrading

I think there will be a price increase, if they go to laser. I just hope that it is close to the current prices.
Mike Garrett
AV Science Sales
585-671-2968
mike@avscience.com

JVC, Sony, Epson, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Onkyo, Stewart, Seymour, Screen Innovations, Screen Excellence, DNP, Carada, Da-Lite, Vutec, Triad, SVS, Martin Logan, Def Tech, RBH, M&K and many other brands.

Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2016, 09:04:57 AM »
I think people in the RS500/600 market would pay a bit extra for the laser increase (say it's up to $300-500 more).

It might make sense for the RS400 to stay lamp the more I think about it.

Aside from total fades to blacks, does the laser affect contrast ratio for better or worse than lamp, or just the same?

Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2016, 09:42:19 AM »
If lumens remain about the same, then I would think contrast would be about the same. Increasing the lumens and maintaining the contrast is the hard part. :)
Mike Garrett
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JVC, Sony, Epson, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Onkyo, Stewart, Seymour, Screen Innovations, Screen Excellence, DNP, Carada, Da-Lite, Vutec, Triad, SVS, Martin Logan, Def Tech, RBH, M&K and many other brands.

bmoney

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Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2016, 09:50:09 AM »
hours would go way up correct?

Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2016, 09:51:47 AM »
I think people in the RS500/600 market would pay a bit extra for the laser increase (say it's up to $300-500 more).

It might make sense for the RS400 to stay lamp the more I think about it.

Aside from total fades to blacks, does the laser affect contrast ratio for better or worse than lamp, or just the same?

If a adjustable laser lamp can turn all of.. wont that make the dynamics in low level scenes suffer, i dont see how its possible to maintain any form of calibration if the lamp/ laser power dont remain the same, just like with a auto iris.. Or how is that surposed to work.?
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Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2016, 10:33:32 AM »
I think people in the RS500/600 market would pay a bit extra for the laser increase (say it's up to $300-500 more).

It might make sense for the RS400 to stay lamp the more I think about it.

Aside from total fades to blacks, does the laser affect contrast ratio for better or worse than lamp, or just the same?


I think a lot of folks are waiting to see actual reviews of the new RS4500 ( like from Kris Deering for one ) for the answer to this question. But all things being equal ( like lumens ), I wouldn't think that laser would be worse contrast wise.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2016, 10:39:57 AM by AVSCraig »
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Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2016, 10:59:09 AM »
Given it appears the production quantities of the RS4500 won't be shipping until Jan. 2017 and assuming the rumors are correct that there will be replacements for the current eShift models coming out in the Mar./April time frame, then I would expect all of these models to carry over until 2018.  If that guess is correct then what new model(s) might be introduced at CEDIA could be nothing at all or perhaps a lamp-based native 4K model priced above the RS600 (or RS650 if that's the new model replacing the RS600) but well below the RS4500.  I would expect such a model to perhaps use the same chassis/case as the eShift models  as well as offering similar brightness.  Perhaps the same lens as the eShift models as well, or a slightly upgraded version, would be used.  I would think that such a new native 4K model would retail in the $15K price range to directly compete with Sony's VW5xx/6xx series of projectors.
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Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2016, 01:59:46 PM »
Given it appears the production quantities of the RS4500 won't be shipping until Jan. 2017 and assuming the rumors are correct that there will be replacements for the current eShift models coming out in the Mar./April time frame, then I would expect all of these models to carry over until 2018.  If that guess is correct then what new model(s) might be introduced at CEDIA could be nothing at all or perhaps a lamp-based native 4K model priced above the RS600 (or RS650 if that's the new model replacing the RS600) but well below the RS4500.  I would expect such a model to perhaps use the same chassis/case as the eShift models  as well as offering similar brightness.  Perhaps the same lens as the eShift models as well, or a slightly upgraded version, would be used.  I would think that such a new native 4K model would retail in the $15K price range to directly compete with Sony's VW5xx/6xx series of projectors.

That is a logical guess - and we only have 10 months to wait until Cedia 2017 to find out !
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Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2016, 10:18:26 PM »
From what I was told the RS600 replacement will have 2000+ lumens and contrast is upgraded to 160000:1+ native. I have no idea what the light source is however. It was also suggested that these replacement models will be the last eshift models JVC makes.

Personally, I'll most likely skip this new generation if it's just a small bump in brightness and contrast. I don't even think a laser version with eshift will sway me to upgrade my RS500. I get the stability and lengthy time frame of the light source appeal of the laser. I just don't put enough hours on my projectors to warrant that upgrade. The laser does nothing for image quality accept perhaps a larger gamut and faster dynamic iris compared to what JVC is using right now. But still, my RS500 does P3 just fine and it's DI performance is essentially class leading anyways. I think, at the moment, only a native 4K projector from JVC (either lamp or laser) will make me upgrade my RS500. I have a desktop gaming setup that I like so a gaming mode with low lag wouldn't do anything for me. I mean, what else can JVC do to make it's image nicer?

I have a couple small complaints with the current models, but none of the issues alter image quality in any meaningful way. But I'd still like JVC to get rid of lens streaking and internal reflections. I'd also like it so bright corners isn't an issue anymore. My guess is that JVC will rectify that last one seeing how the issue made most major pro-reviews. The first two issues I mentioned would necessitate higher quality optics and coatings to reduce internal reflections. If they accomplish that it would probably mean higher ANSI contrast. If you saw the IFA slideshow for the RS4500, they mention that it's using a new prism that does exactly that; reduces reflections and is more light efficient. They also mention that the new .69" DiLA imagers scatter and diffuse less light. I really hope they're at least using this new prism in the cheaper models to reduce reflections/light scatter and that they continue to refine their 4K imagers to get rid of more and more light scatter.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2016, 10:37:33 PM by seegs108 »

Re: What do you think JVC will show CEDIA 2017
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2016, 10:29:55 AM »
From what I was told the RS600 replacement will have 2000+ lumens and contrast is upgraded to 160000:1+ native. I have no idea what the light source is however. It was also suggested that these replacement models will be the last eshift models JVC makes.

Personally, I'll most likely skip this new generation if it's just a small bump in brightness and contrast. I don't even think a laser version with eshift will sway me to upgrade my RS500. I get the stability and lengthy time frame of the light source appeal of the laser. I just don't put enough hours on my projectors to warrant that upgrade. The laser does nothing for image quality accept perhaps a larger gamut and faster dynamic iris compared to what JVC is using right now. But still, my RS500 does P3 just fine and it's DI performance is essentially class leading anyways. I think, at the moment, only a native 4K projector from JVC (either lamp or laser) will make me upgrade my RS500. I have a desktop gaming setup that I like so a gaming mode with low lag wouldn't do anything for me. I mean, what else can JVC do to make it's image nicer?

I have a couple small complaints with the current models, but none of the issues alter image quality in any meaningful way. But I'd still like JVC to get rid of lens streaking and internal reflections. I'd also like it so bright corners isn't an issue anymore. My guess is that JVC will rectify that last one seeing how the issue made most major pro-reviews. The first two issues I mentioned would necessitate higher quality optics and coatings to reduce internal reflections. If they accomplish that it would probably mean higher ANSI contrast. If you saw the IFA slideshow for the RS4500, they mention that it's using a new prism that does exactly that; reduces reflections and is more light efficient. They also mention that the new .69" DiLA imagers scatter and diffuse less light. I really hope they're at least using this new prism in the cheaper models to reduce reflections/light scatter and that they continue to refine their 4K imagers to get rid of more and more light scatter.

On the RS600 replacement, are you talking about the mild refresh that people have been talking about or what you expect to see at CEDIA 2017?
Mike Garrett
AV Science Sales
585-671-2968
mike@avscience.com

JVC, Sony, Epson, Marantz, Denon, Yamaha, Onkyo, Stewart, Seymour, Screen Innovations, Screen Excellence, DNP, Carada, Da-Lite, Vutec, Triad, SVS, Martin Logan, Def Tech, RBH, M&K and many other brands.